Making a start !

For discussion of the issues faced when building a model or layout - how to replicate wood, what glues to use, exactly how much weathering can a Gnat take, a good source of detailing accessories - you get the picture, I'm sure.

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Postby More_Cats_Than_Sense » Sun Mar 04, 2007 10:17 am

Hard to believe that the whole thing is under three square feet! :shock: The quality and placement of the details makes it seem larger :D

Nice attention to detail, it's hardly apparant that is is such a simple trackplan. I especially like the sandstone edging between the pavement and the edge of the rail :D :D

An excellent advertisement for Gn15 :D :D :D

Well done Richard, you must be pleased with the way it has turned out.
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Postby More_Cats_Than_Sense » Sun Mar 04, 2007 10:22 am

DCRfan wrote:I have one worry though, how does the boat builder secure his tools at night :?


The kennels with the six Rottweilers is around the back............. :lol: :twisted: :lol: :lol:
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Re: making a start

Postby Steve Bennett » Sun Mar 04, 2007 10:56 am

Richard Andrews wrote:Thanks Steve, the layout really looks great in the photo's. It was great to see you yesterday, I had a really good day, it did me the power of good.


Glad you approve and that you enjoyed the day, it really was good fun.

I thought that I had taken an overall shot of the layout from the front, but didnt. If you have one, I think it would be worth adding here, you can send it to me if you like.
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Postby Steve Bennett » Sun Mar 04, 2007 11:22 am

SpeedLimit20 wrote:Can i ask you or Richard a question?
Assuming that the little layout has its own lighting rig, can you describe how it is set up please? If you have any "far away" shots that show the lighting rig and whole layout presentation, could you guys post a couple of suitable piccies please?


Unfortunately, I thought I had taken an overall shot, but now find that I didnt, hopefully Richard did.
The layout is displayed on it's own stand, a bit like a bookcase, with a shelf below the layout for spare stock. There is an upright pole attached to the rear of the stand behind the boatbuilders building, to which a single spotlight is attached. The stand also has a cloth drape, from the bottom of the layout to the floor which hides it from the public viewing side. To be honest, the layout looks so good, you dont really notice these things, you eye is drawn straight to the modelled scene. It was only when looking at my photo's last night that I even noticed that there is no backscene, it didnt even register at the show that it didnt have one and I was looking at it all day :) .
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Postby Jim Snee » Sun Mar 04, 2007 12:43 pm

All I can say about that layout is:

WOW!!!

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Postby AndyA » Sun Mar 04, 2007 2:54 pm

A superb piece of work. I really really like it and if there is an overall shot in existence, I'd like to see it.

I'd like to say it's persuaded me to find the tools under the morass of overdue paperwork and spend a few hours, but I think there might be one Gnatterboxer fewer if I don't do some housework and spend a little time with my wife.

Regarding compression, I don't use photobucket but I'm assuming the compression is the standard JPEG compression factor, in which case, although it's a bit of a matter of personal taste, try starting out at 35% and work from there.

In addition, if the software you use for resizing also has a function called 'unsharp mask', try applying that before reducing in size. Most pro's will probably throw their hands up in horror, and I gnow that's not really what it's meant for, but in the specific case where you're going to reduce the size and then apply JPEG compression, it appears to offset some of the detail loss at higher compression ratios. I say 'appears' because that's gnot what it actually does, but in good old Gn15 fashion the eye is fooled. There are usually a number of arcane parameters but for bodging purposes the only one to worry about is 'radius'. Start at 3, work up and down from there, and if you don't think it's making any difference to the result, ignore the advice :).

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Postby Sir Briand » Sun Mar 04, 2007 4:01 pm

I note that you using DG (?) couplers again Richard and am curious as to what the operating sequence is.

What uncouplers are you using and where are they located?

I am seriously thinking of making my next effort more of an operational one rather than a circling one and this one has certainly inspired me.
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Postby michael » Sun Mar 04, 2007 4:27 pm

Richard thank you for your inspirational work, I can see that I still have a great deal to learn. I love the details, It seems that the boat builder is a very tidy chap even swept up the wood shavings or paint scrapings so that the photographer could take postcard quality pics to send to the "tourist bureau" :twisted:

And thanks to Steve for posting these wonderful pics of your layout.
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Making a start

Postby richard andrews » Sun Mar 04, 2007 4:31 pm

With regards to the lighting rig, I used a ajustable mop handle [one of those you can extend ], cut off the mop holding part,but left the swivel part. I then bent a right angle on a piece of ali flat bar, long enough to drill a 6mm hole to fix this to the mop handle. A 6mm hole was also drilled at the other end of the flat bar to fix the spot light to. The bar length is about 12" long.
The handle is fixed to the back of the stand by going through a hole in a piece of flat steel bar with a stop collar welded to it, and then sits in another stop collar again welded to a flat bar but without the hole.
A screw is threaded through the top collar which locks the handle in place,simple and easy to set up. 8) 8) 8) 8)
I will send Steve some photo's.
regards Richard

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Making a start

Postby richard andrews » Sun Mar 04, 2007 4:49 pm

The couplers i use are the Bemo 4mm ones with a piece of soft iron wire soldered to one of the down legs, magnets are placed in the track bed at convenient spots, i always set the magnets using the longest wagon to be used, leaving enough space between the magnet and buffer stop/ next wagon so that the wagon can be coupled up.hope this is of help.
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Re: Making a start

Postby Sir Briand » Sun Mar 04, 2007 5:07 pm

Richard Andrews wrote:The couplers i use are the Bemo 4mm ones with a piece of soft iron wire soldered to one of the down legs, magnets are placed in the track bed at convenient spots...
Richard


Thanks Richard. Where can you get these?
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Postby Steve Bennett » Mon Mar 05, 2007 12:40 pm

I did take the opportunity to photograph the Bemo couplers on Richards stock on saturday, so as there seems to be some interest, here they are.

First couple of shots to show what they look like and how they are fitted, these are stock Bemo couplers, the only modification is the addition of a soft steel wire soldered on to enable magnetic uncoupling as described by Richard above.

Image
Image

This third pic shows a wagon on the layout, if you look at the coupler on the left, you should see the couplers loop is lifted in the uncoupled position and the wire underneath which is being drawn down by the magnet. The coupler on the right is in the normal position, hope that makes sense.

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Postby Sir Briand » Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:03 pm

Thanks Steve for posting those.

Looking through a 2004 copy of Narrow Gauge World I see that Parkside Dundas advertised Bemo OO9 couplings. These come straight or stepped shaft. From the looks of Richards I would say straight shaft.

Is that a rabbit I see before me :?:
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Postby Steve Bennett » Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:20 pm

Sir Briand wrote:Thanks Steve for posting those.

Looking through a 2004 copy of Narrow Gauge World I see that Parkside Dundas advertised Bemo OO9 couplings. These come straight or stepped shaft. From the looks of Richards I would say straight shaft.

Is that a rabbit I see before me :?:


Hi Brian, yes they are the straight version that Richard has used. I'm not sure if the stepped ones might not be easier to fit, if I remember correctly, they are stepped upward and could possibly be mounted under the bufferbeam of the wagon and not need any carving, but that is pure guesswork. Parkside Dundas normally have them in stock, they are quite popular for HOe/HOm/009 and I believe are supplied in pairs, or packs of 12.

:lol: No, that is not a rabbit, but a Crab :) dont think I got a decent pic of it unfortunately, it looks much better from above.
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Postby Peter » Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:23 pm

And here I thought it was a lost glove :oops:
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Postby Steve Bennett » Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:28 pm

Here is another shot with the crab in it :)

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Postby ian holmes » Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:38 pm

Far be it from me to criticize the quality of Richards modelling. Superb as usual. But. There's one thing that really jars my eye.
Now I don't know what the location of the model is supposed to be but we've got a boat builders there it really feels to me like we are on a dockside and it would be nice if the front edge of the layout was finished as a harbour wall rather than the curtain that appears in the photos perhaps a bollard or two to tie a boat up to. Thats just my opinion. Richard has really created a nice "small cornish harbour" ambience and I just feel that those extra touches would lift the model even higher.
Just my twopenn'orth.
The model still makes me want to quit :D

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Postby richard andrews » Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:48 pm

:oops: :oops: :oops: Yes Ian, thats a very good idea, I shall have to find some thing to make the bollards out of. maybe a couple of those map pins? :) :) :) :) regards Richard

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Postby Peter » Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:56 pm

it would be nice if the front edge of the layout was finished as a harbour wall rather than the curtain that appears in the photos perhaps a bollard or two to tie a boat up to.

I'm going to have to disagree with you Ian, from a visual standpoint such a feature would immediately draw the eye away from the rest of the layout and toward the water, of course that isn't a unsurmountable problem, and with Richards ability he would no doubt turn it into an asset :wink:
However I really have to object on narrative terms. By leaving that out the water itself you leave open all sorts of potential stories. Perhaps the water is actually a couple of hundred feet away. Thats why the railway was built in the first place, to allow fish to be hauled from the waterline into town, where the fish market is. Maybe the line has some cars fitted to haul the small boats down to the dock, heck maybe the track even goes right into the water to allow the boats to be launched right off the railway (the Delaware and Hudson did this in fact on Lake George with luxury yachts for the rich and famous).
I think Richard has achieved a balance between detailing the scene visually and narratively and it is that balance that makes it feel so alive to me.

The model still makes me want to quit

Me too. :o

edit:
Richard Andrews wrote::oops: :oops: :oops: Yes Ian, thats a very good idea, I shall have to find some thing to make the bollards out of. maybe a couple of those map pins? :) :) :) :) regards Richard

But then, it isn't my layout :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops:
Last edited by Peter on Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Sir Briand » Mon Mar 05, 2007 1:58 pm

Steve Bennett wrote:Parkside Dundas normally have them in stock, they are quite popular for HOe/HOm/009 and I believe are supplied in pairs, or packs of 12.


Just phoned them and ordered some straight ones. They come in packs of 10. They only had the straight in stock. Of course I ordered them before I had read your post. Ah well :roll:

I should point out that the phone call rate to UK is 6 cents Canadian/minute which is 0.02619 British Pound :!: so I was not being extravagant :D
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Postby Sir Briand » Mon Mar 05, 2007 2:10 pm

I tend to agree with Peter. It is quite possible that the section shown is actually at a slightly higher level than the quay itself so the water would not be at the edge shown. Not so high though that a railing would be needed. I say leave as is. No need for the bollards Richard.
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Postby Steve Bennett » Mon Mar 05, 2007 2:32 pm

Have just recieved some more pics from Richard, a quick resize and here they are.

Image
Image
Image
Image

I'm guessing that like me, Richard didnt get an overall shot at the show, as this is taken back at home. It shows how short of space he is, it is sat on top of another layout.

Image

And finally a few shots of his lighting set-up which he described easlier in the thread, which will hopefully help to understand the written description.

Image
Image
Image
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Postby Gerry Bullock » Mon Mar 05, 2007 2:43 pm

Sir Briand wrote:Just phoned them and ordered some straight ones. They come in packs of 10. They only had the straight in stock. Of course I ordered them before I had read your post. Ah well :roll:



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Postby andrew milner » Mon Mar 05, 2007 3:03 pm

Just to offer my appreciation of some fine modelling too! I think the lighting looks great, a nice representation of a sunny day and only one set of shadows ( I hate seeing multiple 'suns'!). My opinion (from one who has yet to build a layout!) I don't think it needs anything more on the front such as a seawall, but a backdrop would be nice! Great work Richard.
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Postby Steve Bennett » Mon Mar 05, 2007 5:14 pm

Andrew Milner wrote:I think the lighting looks great, a nice representation of a sunny day and only one set of shadows ( I hate seeing multiple 'suns'!).


Good point Andrew, I did mean to mention that Richards pics taken at the show, were done under the layout lighting, unlike mine which used flash. The single light source does work very well, it is located almost directly above the boat that is out in the open, if you studied the shadows, you probably worked that one out already :)
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