The Stamping Ground Gold Mine

For discussion of the issues faced when building a model or layout - how to replicate wood, what glues to use, exactly how much weathering can a Gnat take, a good source of detailing accessories - you get the picture, I'm sure.

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Postby gfadvance » Tue Jul 08, 2008 9:08 pm

Those videos are pretty d..m impressive - theres a lot going on and it all seems to work perfectly and looks very realistic.

Just a thought, bit cheeky from someone who is struggling to get first layout moving along, but maybe it would look even more impressive if the water wheel revolved slightly slower - the working ones I have seen seemed to revolve from memory about one revolution every 10to 15 sec or so. What that equates to in our scale I have no idea

Anyway at whatever speed its all fantastic modelling
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Postby Steve Bennett » Wed Jul 09, 2008 12:07 am

Your layout never fails to impress Glen. Each time you show it there is something else that I didnt see before. Seeing it in motion is even better, it certainly is a busy little layout, with plenty happening. I think the sound of the stamps would drive me mad listening to them all day, I'm not sure how you cope with that :) .

If I may offer a suggestion? I think you could do with a figure at the tipping point from the upper level, though I'm not sure if you would have clearance to get the train past. It need not be a figure posed to tip the wagons, in fact would look better just leaning against the rock in a relaxed position. Just the fact of having a person there, would be enough to associate him with tipping the skips. Just an idea :wink:
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Postby Glen A » Wed Jul 09, 2008 8:26 pm

Thanks for the feedback.

gfadvance wrote:maybe it would look even more impressive if the water wheel revolved slightly slower


Thanks, have been thinking about that. It requires a bigger pulley wheel (which is easy enough to get), but the critical part is finding a drive belt of exactly the right length. Rubber bands are too short, and a pack of video player drive belts have mainly long ones. But I am looking into it.

Steve Bennett wrote:I think the sound of the stamps would drive me mad listening to them all day


Actually they sound louder and harsher on the video, than they do standing behind the layout. The pitch sounds softer in real life. Possibly all those foam rocks dampen the sound. Any way I don't really notice them at all.


Steve Bennett wrote:If I may offer a suggestion? I think you could do with a figure at the tipping point from the upper level, though I'm not sure if you would have clearance to get the train past. It need not be a figure posed to tip the wagons, in fact would look better just leaning against the rock in a relaxed position. Just the fact of having a person there, would be enough to associate him with tipping the skips. Just an idea


All suggestions welcome. Actually someone else also suggested a man dumping wagons at the show. I did try to put someone there, but as you suspected, the clearance wasn’t enough for the train to get past them. I will make a new figure, and blast out some rock to make them fit before the next show. I like your idea about leaning on a rock.

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Postby gfadvance » Wed Jul 09, 2008 8:39 pm

[quote="Glen A"] Rubber bands are too short, and a pack of video player drive belts have mainly long ones.[quote="Glen A"]

Obviously don't know the length you need but have you tried the assorted packs of "o-rings" you can normally get from plumbers merchants - they are used as part of the sel on plastic water pipes etc.
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Postby Oztrainz » Wed Jul 09, 2008 10:20 pm

Hi Glen,
Also check out engineering places that sell either roller bearings or hydraulics. Various sized neoprene o rings are used as oil seals on bearings and also for seals on hydraulic cylinders and valve stems.
:idea: Got anyone near you who fixes mining machiney and could use some advertising -
"Water wheel powered by..[insert firm name here]"
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Postby DCRfan » Thu Jul 10, 2008 5:59 am

Glen A wrote:Thanks, have been thinking about that. It requires a bigger pulley wheel (which is easy enough to get), but the critical part is finding a drive belt of exactly the right length. Rubber bands are too short, and a pack of video player drive belts have mainly long ones. But I am looking into it.



Glen,

Make you own belt. Peter Sewell (Piha Tramway layout) made his own O rings/drive belts for his 9mm scale locos and had never had one fail. He brought the rubber from industrial supply shop who sell it for custom size seals simply by cutting to required length with a clean cut, spot of super glue and hold togerher until dried. He used industrial grade super glue not the 2 $ Shop variety.
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Postby Prof Klyzlr » Thu Jul 10, 2008 6:05 am

RE Super Glue for Rubber and other "hard to glue" things

Suggest Locktite CA,
(vicious liquid CA version that will stick your fingers together quick as wink at you :wink: ),

or slower setting "Zap a Gap" CA on surfaces primed with Locktite 770 Poly-olefin primer.

Reliably sticks rubber RC car/plane fuel line tubing to styrene, brass, and balsa,
also enabled me to stick a Grandt-Line Climax Uni-Sleeve-Uni set to the motor shaft of a Black Beetle,and use it as a torque-transmitting working drivetrain on an On30 loco...
Happy Modelling,
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Postby DCRfan » Thu Jul 10, 2008 6:16 am

'Locktite CA' yes that's what he used.
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Postby Glen A » Thu Jul 10, 2008 11:47 pm

Thanks for that. The pack of replacement video player drive belts that I got has plenty of spares longer than I will even need, so I'll cut a few up and have a go.

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Postby Glen A » Sat Jul 12, 2008 9:04 pm

This can only mean one thing...

Image

I need to dream up some scenery to put on it :lol:

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Postby dr5euss » Sat Jul 12, 2008 10:27 pm

Excellent, looking forward to this :)

It looks slightly higher....will the boards be linked together?

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Postby Glen A » Sun Jul 13, 2008 12:43 am

dr5euss wrote:It looks slightly higher....will the boards be linked together?


Yes they will join up. This is for the high level line, (which can be seen between the yellow building and the cliff face).

The other thing that doesn't show up very well, is the ends aren't square.
So it starts to form an arc. And when the 3rd module is added (yes there will be another :shock: :twisted: ) and you are standing behind operating it, you will be able to see around the cliff faces, and see what is going on down the other end of the layout.

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Postby Gavin Sowry » Sun Jul 13, 2008 7:15 am

:roll: :twisted: But, will it all fit in the car in one go. :?: :?: :?:
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Postby Oztrainz » Sun Jul 13, 2008 7:33 am

Yes - but only if the driver stays outside the car :twisted: :P
With 3 bits planned, I'm betting its is gnow a "dedicated trailer" job.
I hope Glen has had the budget approved :lol:
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Postby Prof Klyzlr » Sun Jul 13, 2008 7:53 am

Dear Crew,

As John G will tell you, my early work was a single module 2' X 4' layout, that fit in the rear of a Corolla 4x4 wagon, or easily in a Tarago.

I then had a fit of madness an went for a 3 X 2'x4' modular layout which required a dedicated trailer and canopy. (Funnily enough, built from the same qubelok 1" aluminium square tube and joiners that the layout framing was built from!?!?!? :? )

Anyway, while that layout achieved what it was designed for,
lessons were learned, and now,
(unless some practical life issue change drastically),
a layout which packs down into a single 2'X4'x 2' tall module,
weighing less than 20kilos,
and fully capable of single person setup/teardown/transport,
is the "ruling specification"... :wink:
Happy Modelling,

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Postby Korschtal » Sun Jul 13, 2008 8:22 am

I like the comment from one of the Spectators on the longer video as the wagon starts to climb the incline: "Woah, Cool!"
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Postby Glen A » Sun Jul 13, 2008 8:30 pm

Gavin Sowry wrote::roll: :twisted: But, will it all fit in the car in one go. :?: :?: :?:


Yes it will at this stage, I can fit two modules in the back of the car at once. But there is not much room for bags etc (unless I leave my wife behind :? )

The full 3 modules are only intended for display in Christchurch at this stage. The exhibition stadium is not far from my house, so if I have to do two trips it doesn't matter. But the major reason is that there are plenty of other people I can enlist to help run it. At its full length, the 3 (or 4 :?: , NO three :twisted: ) modules will need two people to drive as the long line will be a point to point operation.

When I go further out of town I only plan to take the first module, as I am usually on my own (actually my wife comes too, but she won't drive it, so she doesn't count :? ). And one module is more than enough fun for one person to operate all weekend.

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Postby Glen A » Sun Jul 20, 2008 8:16 am

A bit more progress on the module this weekend
There is room at one end for a fairly substantial bridge...

Image

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Postby Glen A » Wed Jul 23, 2008 8:36 pm

Work on the bridge for the gap in the picture above is now well under way.

Because it is going to be on a curve :twisted: I bought a piece of Hornby set track so the rails were already bent to the correct shape. This means I wouldn't end up with the rails twisting and warping the bridge because they were being held under tension.

I removed the sleepers, and made my own:

Image

And here is the deck finished, with beams and corbels attached:

Image


Now for the piles:
:?: Should they be straight as at left or tapered as at right :?:

Image

I am thinking about using rails as diagonal cross bracing (because thats what they do on the standard railway bridges here in NZ).
Any suggestions :?:

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Postby Steve Bennett » Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:15 pm

Definately the A frame version Glen. At that sort of height and especially on a curve, the stress would need to be spread to keep it stable. Could probably do with being spread even wider really.
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Postby dr5euss » Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:26 pm

Yep, the one on the right.

You could even do a vertical middle one between the two sloping ones, unless you've cut and stained them already?

Very nice job on that bridge, btw; it looks fanstastic 8)

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Postby dr5euss » Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:13 pm

I've been thinking...three piles would be too much.

Stick with two, in an A shape :)

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Postby Prof Klyzlr » Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:59 pm

Dear Glen,

2 pile angled has numerous prototype examples in Aust and NZ,

3 pile has numerous examples in Aust, esp on the East Coast, (NSW and Vic logging tramways),

2 pile "straight" bent in Aust are strictly limited to LOW (less than 10' tall) trestles,
on straight trackage.
(They is virtually no support for lateral "sway" movement, inherrent in curved trackage operation! :wink: )

Ergo, I "vote" for 2 OR 3 pile "angled" bents... :wink:

Using rail as the diagonal bracing is OK, as long as you remember that steel works fine in tension, but not in compression. Also remember that you will need some LONG bridgespikes to "hold the whole thing together"... :wink:

Proto photos available if required....
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Postby NICKJW » Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:36 am

Very nice work. The composition of the layout and overall 'balance' is bang-on! Nice one.

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Postby DCRfan » Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:27 pm

Like the look of the bridge very much. I agree with everyone tapered piles because it is a curved bridge although another option is two parallel piles with smaller tapered braces on each pile. I'll send you a picture of an NZ prototype tomorrow, oops later today.
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