Simplicity Sidings

For discussion of the issues faced when building a model or layout - how to replicate wood, what glues to use, exactly how much weathering can a Gnat take, a good source of detailing accessories - you get the picture, I'm sure.

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Postby Steve Bennett » Wed Sep 10, 2008 11:22 am

Bob Taylor wrote:Looking forward to the "second board". Might there be board three or four in the pipe line? Honest question, not trying to start rumors :)


:lol: Well, I think the small second board will be all, but there is the possibility for adding more at a later date. In fact, I could just keep adding to it, will need to put up a shelf though, as this is the limit of how long my desk will take :) .

Another idea floating around in my head, which I dont have time for at the moment. is a different second board. This would be about 18 inches long (the most I can fit) with a shed at the far left housing a traverser serving both tracks. Then I could run trains from the shed into the yard, changing from one track to the other, inside the shed. This would give a self contained layout 30" long. I quite like the idea, but wether it will get built, remains to be seen :) .
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Postby gfadvance » Wed Sep 10, 2008 12:54 pm

:D Well there has been lots of activity while I have been off on holiday - and with 346 posts to catch on I'm going to have decided whither to model or read :?:

Very impressed with the various layouts which have appeared and with the grass/vegatation ideas from Steve, must remember this for when I am adding some greenery to mine.

Noticed way back last week there were some comments about size of layouts out of interest mine is 15" x 7" so a bit bigger than Steves but not by much.

While off have managed to produce a some ladders , weathered planks, nameboard and assorted rubbish so wil get these in place over the next few days and post some pictures later. Also found in deepest Somerset enough information for me to draw up a scale drawing off an old grocers delivery boys bicycle so I'm going to have a go at modelling this (complete with as near as I can scale spokes) to rest against one of the walls.

Also found out some information on Somerset oil fields in the 1920's so that has sown some thoughts for the future :lol:
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Postby Steve Bennett » Wed Sep 10, 2008 3:52 pm

gfadvance wrote:While off have managed to produce a some ladders , weathered planks, nameboard and assorted rubbish so wil get these in place over the next few days and post some pictures later.


Good to see you back and will be looking forward to seeing what additions you made while on holiday :) I'm sure you will amaze us once again :) .
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Sinplicity Sidings

Postby b1gy1n » Sat Sep 13, 2008 9:41 pm

Steve the stading figure where does he hail from.

ps like the barbed wire fence.

regards Marc 8)
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Re: Sinplicity Sidings

Postby Steve Bennett » Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:52 am

b1gy1n wrote:Steve the stading figure where does he hail from.


Apologies for the delay replying Marc, have been away.
The figure is a SLM one named Melvin (see http://www.slmonline.com).
Be worth trying Back2Bay6 first, Steve normally has them in stock.
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Re: Sinplicity Sidings

Postby Glen A » Wed Sep 17, 2008 8:05 pm

Steve Bennett wrote:Apologies for the delay replying Marc, have been away.


I thought it was unusual that you hadn’t posted anything for 5 days! :lol: :lol:

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Postby AndyA » Thu Sep 18, 2008 11:15 am

Back from Budapest today is set aside for admin stuff that can be done on autopilot, so fortunately the next bit of Kirrin doesn't take much brain-power. This is the ceremonial track-burying. I'm doing it the same way I have for a couple of abortive dioramas, so it should work out okay.

First, though, a bodge and a thought. When I built the two boards for myself, I never intended connecting them, but just before I flew out Steve posted about the extra board. So, well, I thought...

Image

But as you can see there was a problem. The couple of mil error that Widley spotted at the beginning (not true really, a different couple of mil but it would have made a good story). So, I levered up the short track, sanded everything, relaid it and put it to dry.

Below, however, is an illustration of an idea I had while sitting in a bar watching trams at the second simplest tram terminus in the world.

Image

I did wonder how close the spacing would be and this morning I found it was quite close. I'm not going to re-lay everything, but if anyone else is thinking of having a go, matching the spacing to standard Peco stuff might be worthwhile.

Now, since the Kirrin board is drying (again), I'll start the burying work on htis, which is simpler anyway (this one will be clad with Steve's paving slabs, as a try-out for Pilgrim Quay). I started by cutting three strips of 2mm card to but up to the sleeper ends. This stuff will be invisible so accurate cutting isn't strictly necessary, which is just as well given my complete lack of brain cells this morning (the journey from Gatwick to Southampton by train took longer than getting from the hotel to Ferighey airport, checking in, going through security, boarding, flying to Heathrow, clearing customs, finding the baggage...).

Image

I didn't glue it down quite yet, I needed another layer of card about 1mm thick, and I used the 2mm strips as a template because my cutting isn't brilliant. Normally I'd use packaging card but we cleared everything out before we left, so I've laminated it out of two layers of thin card. It's drying under a sheet of glass. I'll do it properly with the other more complicated board.

Image

Now I've glued the 2mm card in place. The extra shim will bring the level up to just about sleeper level, so that I can glue card strips direct onto the sleepers between the rails and have the final surface level.

Image

Everything has to dry, so since it's a nice day I think I'll go shopping.

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Postby Steve Bennett » Thu Sep 18, 2008 11:44 am

AndyA wrote:Below, however, is an illustration of an idea I had while sitting in a bar watching trams at the second simplest tram terminus in the world.

Image

I did wonder how close the spacing would be and this morning I found it was quite close. I'm not going to re-lay everything, but if anyone else is thinking of having a go, matching the spacing to standard Peco stuff might be worthwhile.


Had been thinking about using two turnouts for a crossover aswell Andy, but hadnt thought of using Peco's track spacing :roll: , they even do a gauge to get the spacing right :) not sure where mine is though :roll:
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Postby Bob Taylor » Thu Sep 18, 2008 5:54 pm

I know its going back a few steps but can some kind sole point me in the right direction to actually find the "factory" to print out. I'm sure there is a link but I can't find it :oops:

I'm also assuming that when I do find the link it will have both "walls" ie the one with windows and the plain wall with the door.

Thanks, as ever.


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Postby More_Cats_Than_Sense » Thu Sep 18, 2008 6:09 pm

I've just emailed them to you Bob
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Postby Bob Taylor » Thu Sep 18, 2008 6:14 pm

Barry you are a star :D

Thanks.


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Postby AndyA » Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:04 am

Steve wrote, of my crossover picture:

Had been thinking about using two turnouts for a crossover as well Andy, but hadnt thought of using Peco's track spacing :roll: , they even do a gauge to get the spacing right :) not sure where mine is though :roll:


I'm actually thinking of a crossover like this (courtesy of Paintshop)

Image

I thought Peco made one, but a quick web search failed to find it. If not, I may bodge something.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch. I didn't do any more yesterday when I got back, figuring that I was likely to do more harm than good. Just as well. Although the stuff I'd done yesterday was perfectly okay (meaning that it should be possible for anyone to do this if they're not recovering from the train journey from hell) I'd got my sums wrong. Once I'd glued the yellow card in place:

Image

I placed another layer of 2mm card on top and discovered that it came nearly to track level. So, to give myself thinking time, I cut the 2mm card for the Kirrin board. Despite it being relatively more complex I got it right first time: the card goes to the edge of the sleepers.

Image

the gap is where the weighbrige gubbins room and operator will go. By then, the card on the first board was dry. I sliced up some packaging from photo paper, wide enough to overlap the sleepers and run to the edge of the chairs. This is where the shimming comes into play: the strips glued onto the sleepers between the rails is at the same height.

Image

When dry, this one is now ready for the paving slabs, which will cover the gaps except for the flangeways. The other one will be planked with coffee stirrers. I could use balsa as Steve did, but since this is the whole surface I'm a bit worried that derailments might unduly damage the planks. The glue I'm using, by the way, is runny PVA sold in squeeze bottles for craft work. This spreads easily in the same way as Steve's diluted stuff, but is less messy.

Now once again shopping, to get the stuff I forgot yesterday and to wait for everything to dry, before Shimming the second board for planks.

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Postby More_Cats_Than_Sense » Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:20 am

AndyA wrote:Steve wrote, of my crossover picture:

Had been thinking about using two turnouts for a crossover as well Andy, but hadnt thought of using Peco's track spacing :roll: , they even do a gauge to get the spacing right :) not sure where mine is though :roll:


I'm actually thinking of a crossover like this (courtesy of Paintshop)

Image

I thought Peco made one, but a quick web search failed to find it. If not, I may bodge something.





regards
Andy A


You'll find them Here made by Shinohara, you can get them in code 100, 83, 70 but they are over 19" (49cm) long. I have a code 70 one that I plan to do something with later.
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Postby Bob Taylor » Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:26 pm

I think you can "make" a cross over using PECO track components. Then again I could be talking rubbish :shock:

Nice start though. Interesting idea's.



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Postby steerngo » Fri Sep 19, 2008 5:27 pm

Bob Taylor wrote:I think you can "make" a cross over using PECO track components. Then again I could be talking rubbish :shock:

Nice start though. Interesting idea's.



Bob.


2 lefts, 2rights & a diamond xing, maybe :wink:

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Postby AndyA » Sat Sep 20, 2008 7:08 am

lefts, 2rights & a diamond xing, maybe


...but that makes it very wide as well as very long. I'm going to want to come back to this, so I'll start a new thread to avoid hijacking "Simplicity" too far.

There's a marker, and a request for Barry, here.

Gigging today, so no more progress until tomorrow morning.

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Postby AndyA » Sun Sep 21, 2008 12:15 pm

Today I made some more progress on the surfaces of the two boards. I added another layer of card to the first board (Kirrin, which will be planked), cut a few planks and then moved to the more complete second board, destined for paving slabs the same way Steve did them.

Image

Above, I'm part-way through, stacking them up so I know I've cut enough. It may be worth just summarising how I cut the things, because I need rather more than Steve did. Although the process is somewhat therapeutic, shortcuts help, as you'll see at the end.

Image

I didn't actually 'mark out' as such at all. By trial and error, sanding the card down, I made a strip that would fit between the rails giving a little slack on the flangways. I then cut a two-by-one shape to be the 'master'. I labelled it because I have a habit of losing track. Now I needed several strips, so I used the master, aligning it at each end of the sheet using my X-Acto small (?no5) craft knife, and pricking the end into the card. Now, I can stick the blade into the prick mark and alugn the straight-edge against it. Making a light cut tells you if the alignment is spot on because you can feel the blade ride into the prick mark. Now make a heavier cut and you've got a strip. My old professor would hopefully be pleased that I'm actually using a skill he taught me, but probably nonplussed as to why. :)

Image

Here's the secret weapon. I've had an NWSL 'Chopper' for years, but it's on its last legs. Sue spotted this at a show and bought it for me. It doesn't work anywhere near as well as the Chopper, but this job it does just fine, so I get extra marks for being able to use Sue's pick for something worthwhile. I taped a piece of card into position, using the master butted against the blade as a guide. I hten taped the master to the back of the guillotine bed, because I shall need it later. Cut the leading edge off to make a true right angle. Clear the scrap. Move the strip against the end-stop, cut, slide the piece out (clear with a stick is the advice, probably good advice sine the blade is razor sharp, but I just keep my fingers clear). Move the strip against the end-stop, cut, clear...

Image

This is the finished batch. Allowing for the ones that have to be cut and with a 10% wastage allowance, I need 130 of them. I calculate on that basis that I'll need somewhere around 1600 for Pilgrim Quay. So the shortcuts will help. Next to treat (Method 3) a test batch of nine that'll go between one set of rails.

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Postby Steve Bennett » Sun Sep 21, 2008 12:30 pm

Interesting idea to use the chopper Andy, never would have thought of that . Not sure it would be a lot quicker than a rule and square, but for the pieces between the tracks which need the width set first, it probably is. A lot more satisfying too, putting a bit of brute force into it :lol:

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Postby AndyA » Sun Sep 21, 2008 1:47 pm

Not sure it would be a lot quicker than a rule and square,


Maybe not for you... :)

And if I'm going to do the whole exposed area of Pilgrim Quay, it also has the advantage from my point o view of needing less susained concentration.

Just about to start painting the test set now.

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Postby AndyA » Mon Sep 22, 2008 8:19 am

This should have been posted yesterday afternoon, but I had 'difficulties' connecting to Gnatterbox, so I've edited it slightly.

First, the slabs. At the time I was disappointed. Apart from using acrylic rather than poster colour, I followed Steve's description as far as I could but they didn't look like his do. The problem for me isn't a slight sheen, but hte fact that I couldn't get the mixture to cover the slabs evenly. Il let them dry for a couple of hours, and then re-coated them, but the result still wasn't consistently good. This is the slabs yesterday evening.

Image

Now, the planks. These were cut on the chopper, and 'counted' the same way as the slabs.

Image

Then, I mixed up some acrylic with wet water and put half into each. I left them for a couple of hours, then lifted a third of the light ones and half the dark ones out. moving half the remaining light ones into the dark stain.

Image

it was too dark for photos by then, so I'll post an update later this morning once I work out what I'm going to do with the slabs.

regards
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Postby Steve Bennett » Mon Sep 22, 2008 9:07 am

AndyA wrote:First, the slabs. At the time I was disappointed. Apart from using acrylic rather than poster colour, I followed Steve's description as far as I could but they didn't look like his do. The problem for me isn't a slight sheen, but hte fact that I couldn't get the mixture to cover the slabs evenly. Il let them dry for a couple of hours, and then re-coated them, but the result still wasn't consistently good. This is the slabs yesterday evening.

Image


Having zoomed in on the photo, I'm baffled.
The air bubbles are fairly obviously a problem, which I didnt get, only a few very tiny ones. I can only think that using acrylic makes it work differently. It certainly seems to have tinted the plaster more and I wonder if it does bind the particles together more. If I can find some time will have a go with acrylic and see what results I get.
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Postby AndyA » Mon Sep 22, 2008 10:39 am

The air bubbles are gone, and some of the slabs I gave a second coat last night are now okay. They're darker than Steve's which is what I want, and the good ones look exactly like york stone flags, so it's going to be worth persevering.

Image

Thinking about it, I think the problem may be that my 2mm card ("mountboard") may be shinier than Steve's, meaning that it needs a first coat to get some kind of "key". To this end I've laid out half the remaining pieces in a block and given them a htin coat, which seems to have gone all the way to the edges.

Image

The container holds the remains of the black stain, some of which I used for the new mix of gunk. Speaking of which, I'm pleased with the planks. Only need to do 500 or so nail holes now. :) And figure out how to do the weighbridge, so that I can make a start on the building.

Image

This has given me the impetus to redo the dock for 1160(S), using a mixture of these slabs and planks, with two tracks as I suggested before. I only really needed the nudge, but I'll finish these two first.

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Postby AndyA » Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:40 am

Okay, I finally came got the slabs to the point where (a) I was sort of happy with them and (b) I wasn't prepared to spend any more time. With the mountboard I was using the trick seems to be to give one light coat of the gunk to give a 'key' and then one or more further coats letting the stuff dry completely (not just touch dry) before continuing. Steve commented on the air bubbles in my first set, and the way I fixed them is to dry the brush off (I'm using a cheap half-inch brush meant for watercolours, so a nice point) on a piece of kitchen paper, and then gently brush to the edges. Don't try to correct any errors after the stuff's been on for more than a couple of minutes, let it dry and put another coat on. Dry, the coating is sufficiently waterproof that you can use a damp rag to clean off any surplus PVA, tacky, all that will happen is that the wet mix will lift the layer underneath, making matters worse.

Anyway, armed with tiles of various colours, I started by doing the ones between the rails, leaving a flangeway either side. So far so good. Then I did the two outside edges. I wish I could say that the two-mil gap on one side to just fit the card with which I'll face the building edge was deliberate, but it wasn't. However, I'll make sure that there is one on the other board. Only at this point did I start the piece between the tracks.

Hmmm:

Image

Well on the other board it's seven planks wide, but of course that's three-and-a-half tiles. Can I just cut one set of tiles in half? No, because instead of working my way across, there's a half tile in the left track at this end, a whole tile on the right, and they alternate outwards. So after several false starts I narrowed two sets of tiles, to give narrow, wide, wide, narrow fitting exactly.

Image

Gnot by any means perfect , but the best I can do under the circumstances. One reason for posting thi type of stuff is to convince people that whilst there's occasionally nothing to do but throw the thing in hte bin, most situations can be rescued with a bit of thought. If you can't see your way out of it straight away, go and do something else for a while.

Image

Here's the first row glued in place. Steve would probably just do the whole lot, but I'm going to do one at a time letting it set to touch dry in between. That way if placing the next row of tiles gets PVA on this row, I've a solid base to wipe it off. (And, it must be said, if my cutting is a bit dodgy it won't all be wet and shift around when I have to re-cut the last row.)

On the right are the rest of the tiles. Since there's a bit too much variation I've laid them out a bit like racking up a pool table. I'm not over the moon with the result but with a bit of dirtying down it'll be okay, and I like the technique well enough to plan on doing as I said and redoing the dockside for 1160(S).

regards
Andy A

More this afternoon, after which I'll tackle the planked board.
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gnine: less is the gnew more

GnTonic - enjoy irresponsibly

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Postby AndyA » Sun Oct 05, 2008 2:38 pm

Just a quick note to say finished and dried.

Image

The eagle-eyed will notice a few gaps. Probably the slabs were laid on an inadequate foundation and have shifted over the years. I may experiment later with some weeds. Clearly if I use this technique for Pilgrim Quay it'll need to be neater, but it'll look great for 1160(S).

regards
Andy A
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gnine: less is the gnew more

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Postby dieselwater » Sun Oct 05, 2008 6:15 pm

Those tiles look good. A nice blending of tones and shades.
Little old lines to somewhere.

David.


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