Simplicity Sidings

For discussion of the issues faced when building a model or layout - how to replicate wood, what glues to use, exactly how much weathering can a Gnat take, a good source of detailing accessories - you get the picture, I'm sure.

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Bob Taylor
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Postby Bob Taylor » Wed Aug 13, 2008 6:41 pm

Steve I'm very impressed with your method for painting track. It's these "simple" things you never get demonstrated how to do. It's always assumed!

If doing point work is there anything I should be aware of? Not hi-jacking honest! :wink:



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Postby Colin Peake » Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:03 pm

Jon Randall wrote:How do you cut your rail :?: The only thing I have to cut rail is a mini hacksaw and I struggle to stop the rail pulling out of the chairs, any advice will be welcome.


Jon, I swear by my Xuron cutters for cutting rail these days, much better than cutting disks in minidrills or saws. Considering how cheap they are in relative terms, they are worth the investment. Just remember to keep them as rail cutters only and not to be tempted to use them to cut wire, rods etc!

Steve, I think you actually used a little more paint than I did on my micro when painting the track, but glad to see it worked!

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Postby Steve Bennett » Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:14 pm

gfadvance wrote:Steve, just tried your technique on track on the cassette - brilliant :D


Glad to hear that Gordon. I have to say, it is not my technique, I normally use an airbrush in a similar way, after first using the Red Oxide primer and have done for years. I had heard or using aerosols from various places recently and Colin using it on his Ambassadors Micro
http://forum.gn15.info/viewtopic.php?p=55519#55519
gave me the final push to try it. I have to say, Colin got better results than I did. I will blame that on trying to photograph the process :wink: .
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Postby Trevor Coburn » Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:19 pm

How do you cut your rail The only thing I have to cut rail is a mini hacksaw and I struggle to stop the rail pulling out of the chairs, any advice will be welcome.


I have found that using a piece of softwood, with 2 grouves cut in it (using said junior hacksaw) at the same distance appart as the rails, will work as cutting guide as well. Place on top of the rail press down and gently use the saw. I this is not clear I make one & post a picture.
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Postby More_Cats_Than_Sense » Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:33 pm

Jon Randall wrote:How do you cut your rail :?: The only thing I have to cut rail is a mini hacksaw and I struggle to stop the rail pulling out of the chairs, any advice will be welcome.


I use Xuron Cutters
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Postby Steve Bennett » Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:48 pm

Jon Randall wrote:How do you cut your rail :?: The only thing I have to cut rail is a mini hacksaw and I struggle to stop the rail pulling out of the chairs, any advice will be welcome.


I see I have been beaten to it already, but like Colin and Barry, I use Xuron cutters. A very worthwhile investment if you plan on doing much trackwork. Another alternative is an ordinary pair of side cutters will do the job, but nowhere near as well. Here we have the Xuron cutters on the left and the side cutters that I used prior to getting them, on the right.

Image

and below the results of using both, again from the Xuron ones on the left, the others on the right.

Image

Both create a bit of a burr and require a bit of cleaning up with a file, but I'm sure you can see how much cleaner the cut is on the lefthand piece, especially noticeable on the foot of the rail.
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Postby Steve Bennett » Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:55 pm

Bob Taylor wrote:If doing point work is there anything I should be aware of? Not hi-jacking honest! :wink:


No problem Bob.
The only real difference when spraying turnouts, is that it is adviseable to protect the contact points for the switchblades. A simple way of doing this, is to push a scrap of 2mm thick balsawood, between the open switchblade and stock rail. Part way through spraying, you need to change the position of the switchblades too, otherwise you end up with an unpainted area when the turnout is set to the opposite direction.

Hope that makes sense
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Postby Jon Randall » Wed Aug 13, 2008 8:21 pm

Thanks everybody, I suppose I've been put off by the price of the Xuron cutters but they will last many layouts.
Sorry for the small diversion Steve :oops:
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Postby Steve Bennett » Wed Aug 13, 2008 8:30 pm

Jon Randall wrote:Thanks everybody, I suppose I've been put off by the price of the Xuron cutters but they will last many layouts.
Sorry for the small diversion Steve :oops:


Dont apologise Jon, this thread is all about learning, so questions like that are more than welcome and relevant.
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Postby gfadvance » Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:27 pm

Thanks Colin for the painting tip and thanks Steve - I have layout at last :D

Image

tried not to copy yours too slavishly but also made sure I did not get carried away. About the same depth but a bit longer, and because I ended using using corrugated carboard on top of the foam it gave me the opportunity to recess the wiring.

And before you ask it does work, so of to play trains, thanks again
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Postby SOUTHPASS » Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:48 pm

Good morning....Thanks for this tutorial Steve, I'm sure it will give a few people the incentive to get started on something. Just a quick suggestion, to clean the railtop I use a small block of pinewood soaked in WD40 to rub the railtops. Less chance of catching track pins or anything along railedge. Also handy for cleaning after layout is finished :) . I think, can't say that I have yet finished one :( .
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Postby Willow Creek Traction » Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:24 am

SOUTHPASS wrote:...after layout is finished :) . I think, can't say that I have yet finished one :( .

True, after a layout is finished, one can enjoy the end product of his labor; or, one could start another: to me, there is equal joy in making as there is in having finished.
People are different that way - either is fine.

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Postby Steve Bennett » Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:29 am

gfadvance wrote:Thanks Colin for the painting tip and thanks Steve - I have layout at last :D


Fantastic Gordon, you are partly responsible for this thread anyway, so i'm really pleased to see it worked for you and so fast aswell :) . I hope you get many hours of enjoyment from it and has given you confidence for more adventures in the future. It makes me very happy seeing this :D .
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Postby Nick Ellingworth » Thu Aug 14, 2008 7:09 am

gfadvance wrote:Thanks Colin for the painting tip and thanks Steve - I have layout at last :D

Image

tried not to copy yours too slavishly but also made sure I did not get carried away. About the same depth but a bit longer, and because I ended using using corrugated carboard on top of the foam it gave me the opportunity to recess the wiring.

And before you ask it does work, so of to play trains, thanks again


Excellent work Gordon, the use of cardboard on top was a really good idea, once you start on the scenic work the recessed wiring should be easy to hide. I'm very tempted to have a go at building a layout like the one from this guide but I've already got something similar under construction so I probably won't for the moment.

BTW Steve have you considered writing this up for either the Tome or main site? :wink:

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Postby gfadvance » Thu Aug 14, 2008 7:20 am

Nick Ellingworth wrote:[ the use of cardboard on top was a really good idea


Thanks Nick, but I may have been too clever :!:

As has been pointed out to me, corrugated cardboard has to be handle carefully at the next stage as if it gets too wet doing the scenic work I could end up having problems :(
I been pretty careful to seal it well but when doing it again - am I getting carried away a, 2 layouts :lol: I would either just use ordinary card and cut the channel in that or skin the corrugated card with another layer of ordinary card.

Anyway if it all collapses in a soggy heap I'll post the picture and we can all learn
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Postby Korschtal » Thu Aug 14, 2008 7:23 am

gfadvance wrote:I been pretty careful to seal it well but when doing it again - am I getting carried away a, 2 layouts :lol: I would either just use ordinary card and cut the channel in that or skin the corrugated card with another layer of ordinary card.


I found that an effective method on Westerooge- use 2 or three layers of card and it'll be solid enough- you'll have a job to cut it, in fact.

But I'm getting off the point, sorry Steve...
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Postby Nick Ellingworth » Thu Aug 14, 2008 7:24 am

gfadvance wrote:
Nick Ellingworth wrote:[ the use of cardboard on top was a really good idea


Thanks Nick, but I may have been too clever :!:

As has been pointed out to me, corrugated cardboard has to be handle carefully at the next stage as if it gets too wet doing the scenic work I could end up having problems :(
I been pretty careful to seal it well but when doing it again - am I getting carried away a, 2 layouts :lol: I would either just use ordinary card and cut the channel in that or skin the corrugated card with another layer of ordinary card.

Anyway if it all collapses in a soggy heap I'll post the picture and we can all learn


As long as you're careful I can't see the card being an issue. Take everything slowly and let everything dry properly before moving on but of course you should do that with any scenic work. :wink:

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Postby tstone » Thu Aug 14, 2008 8:24 am

The track that I see everyone using doesn't look like regular HO track (at least not what I've bought here locally). Is that OO or On30 gauge track?

Secondly, is it a bad thing to hand lay the track on a foam board? I had been want to try that, and being such a small layout it seems this is a good opportunity to give a whirl. Bad idea?
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Postby Trevor Coburn » Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:31 am

The track is Peco 0-16.5 / 0e. (O scale narrow gauge track, code 100 rail)
But where I spend most of my time there are no model / hobby shops. So I have to hand build my track. Using Code 100 rail (bog standard H0,) the larger track or Code 80 rail ( N gauge) on Evergreen styrene ties / sleepers. With rail clips from same stuff. This will need to be stuck down. Hope this helps.
Image

Sorry for the interuption Steve, This thread is already getting me rethinking my layout ideas :roll:
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Postby Steve Bennett » Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:55 am

tstone wrote:Secondly, is it a bad thing to hand lay the track on a foam board? I had been want to try that, and being such a small layout it seems this is a good opportunity to give a whirl. Bad idea?


Not a bad idea at all. A small project like this is ideal for trying new techniques, such as handlaying track. You should find the foamcore and card will hold pins and spikes very well.
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Postby martin » Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:06 am

Re: Foam Board strength.

It's something that theatre designers use a lot for model boxes, whilst it can be fiddly in construction: we tend to use glue and pins (removing the pin heads or the entire pins later)

It's flexibility means it can stand up to the punishment of even the clumsiest of master carpenters and scenic construction teams abuse.
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Postby Steve Bennett » Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:08 am

Nick Ellingworth wrote:BTW Steve have you considered writing this up for either the Tome or main site? :wink:


Not really thought about that Nick, I think it is going to be too long anyway and it would lose the interactive element aswell. I dont have any plans to take it any further than this thread, it already has taken more time to compile, than to build the layout :roll: but if anybody wants to make an offer for the film rights :lol:
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Postby Colin Peake » Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:09 am

gfadvance wrote:As has been pointed out to me, corrugated cardboard has to be handle carefully at the next stage as if it gets too wet doing the scenic work I could end up having problems :(


I would imagine that the mixture of spray paints actually does a lot to seal the top layer of the cardboard, I was suprised at the effectiveness of this layer over the foamcore used as a trackbed on Ambasador's, I don't think any water was absorbed during ballasting.

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Postby Steve Bennett » Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:28 am

Colin Peake wrote:I would imagine that the mixture of spray paints actually does a lot to seal the top layer of the cardboard, I was suprised at the effectiveness of this layer over the foamcore used as a trackbed on Ambasador's, I don't think any water was absorbed during ballasting.


It was me that raised the concern over using the corrugated card with Gordon. It was not so much the use of the card, more the cutouts for the wiring. During ballasting, the cutouts would act as a sump for the dilute glue used for setting the ballast, allowing the core to get wet. Anybody that has taken corrugated card apart, to use the centre for roofing will know how easily it comes apart when it gets wet :) . Hopefully it wont be a major problem and Gordon has said he will let us know how it stands up to it, fingers crossed it all works ok.
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Postby Colin Peake » Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:57 am

Steve Bennett wrote:It was me that raised the concern over using the corrugated card with Gordon. It was not so much the use of the card, more the cutouts for the wiring. During ballasting, the cutouts would act as a sump for the dilute glue used for setting the ballast, allowing the core to get wet. Anybody that has taken corrugated card apart, to use the centre for roofing will know how easily it comes apart when it gets wet :) . Hopefully it wont be a major problem and Gordon has said he will let us know how it stands up to it, fingers crossed it all works ok.


Ah... yes... :oops: could a layer of masking tape be inserted under the track to cover them?

I must be posh, I used ready made corrugated stuff on the building I built for Ambasadors. Really must write an update!

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