Scratch building a loco??

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johna
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Scratch building a loco??

Postby johna » Mon Oct 29, 2012 8:43 pm

I would like to scratch build a loco to keep costs down but was wondering if anyone would have a scale drawing of one suitable for GN15/9.

I hope to build the layout from card and everyday things that go in the dustbin. In other words spend no money if possible. I do have a chassis to build the loco around but apart from the track everything must be free or donated. A layout will follow called "Gnusty bin sidings"


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Glen A
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Re: Scratch building a loco??

Postby Glen A » Tue Oct 30, 2012 4:07 am

Hi John,

Not sure how you will get on looking for scale drawing on this group.
I think scale drawings are somewhat over-rated. :lol:

You'll probably achieve the narrow gauge 'character' feel much better if you just make it up as you go.
There are plenty of photos of locos on this group, so pick a couple that you like the look of and start from there.

Cardboard is plentiful in supply, so start with a rectangle the size of the running board.
cut out hole in the middle so it fits down over you motor chassis.
Then add various parts (headstocks each end, a motor bonnet and cab area) as you go. Its easier than you think.
I'm sure you can do it if you try :wink:

And the best part is that no rivet counter can come along later and say you got the scale wrong. :P

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Postby Mark Goodwin » Tue Oct 30, 2012 4:43 am

John,

I agree with Glen. What I usually do is make a scale drawing of the chassis (wheel spacing, height etc) and then draw a design in pencil until I'm satisfied with the design. On other scratchbuilds, I've often made it up as I went along. The key issue is to have a go and get creating your own individual design - and enjoy the process as well. Plasticard (styrene) is a cheap and easy-to-work-with alternative to cardboard and is a welded join when used with the proper styrene cement.
Best wishes,
Mark

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Card

Postby Bilco » Tue Oct 30, 2012 9:03 am

Hi Johna - have a look at this thread - http://forum.gn15.info/viewtopic.php?t=8082 - to see what David has done with card. There are some more threads of his stuff around, too.
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Postby Si » Tue Oct 30, 2012 9:31 am

There are a few books around with scale drawings of min gauge and miniature railways, eg, "The Sutton Park Miniature Railway" has a nice set at the back, and "Narrow Gauge Railways - Two Feet and Under" has one or two min gauge ones.

Obviously you'd need to convert to the right scale, or do the measurement conversions on the fly....not too difficult.

Not aware of anything on line but I'm sure that there will be.

Personally though, I prefer to just use photos as inspiration and build vaguely outline models of the prototypes. This I do for two reasons: the donor chassis will often mean that an exact scale model won't be possible, and the Gn15 'scale'* is generally pretty vague so the track gauge is only an approximation anyway in many cases.

*although most of my min gauge is in O9 but the same principle applies.

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Postby AndyA » Tue Oct 30, 2012 11:16 am

Whilst I'm also normally of the 'Make it up as you go along' school, I can probably either provide a drawing for you, or, potentially more usefully, show you how to do it yourself. First, though, what sort of thing are you looking for, or what chassis are you intending using.

I have what may be the oddest qualification here in the drawings school - I was 'best improver' (The Tolley Prize!!) in the workshop drawing course at uni in 1976. This actually means I was the worst starter in 1975:), but I argue that the experience has taught me how hard some people find it to do this kind of stuff.

I'm currently working on a printy of Ttixi, the cartoon version of the La Rhune cog railway locomotive.

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Postby KEG » Tue Oct 30, 2012 1:15 pm

Simply take a suitable scale driver´s figure and built a loco around it.

Image

Image


Have Fun

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Postby johna » Tue Oct 30, 2012 6:08 pm

AndyA wrote:Whilst I'm also normally of the 'Make it up as you go along' school, I can probably either provide a drawing for you, or, potentially more usefully, show you how to do it yourself. First, though, what sort of thing are you looking for, or what chassis are you intending using.


regards
Andy A


Andy if I build a loco for GNine then I have a kato 4 wheel chassis. For 16.5 gauge I have a number of "bec" motor bogies. I would be grateful if you show me how to do it myself.

John

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Postby chris stockdale » Tue Oct 30, 2012 8:00 pm

John,

Try taking a look at the Loco Shed section.

Cheers,

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Postby thtroll » Tue Oct 30, 2012 9:59 pm

John,
Very talented group here. One thing I have noticed is that they make excellent use limited space, the attention to detail is exquisite and their modeling skills are amazing. Not to hijack but I did notice this in Juergen's post.
Image
I think I even see a neck tie.
Cheers, Heath.

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Postby AndyA » Wed Oct 31, 2012 11:31 am

johna wrote:Andy if I build a loco for GNine then I have a kato 4 wheel chassis. For 16.5 gauge I have a number of "bec" motor bogies. I would be grateful if you show me how to do it myself.

John


Yep, if we take it gently you'll be fine. I think it was 'LBSC', the model engineer, who said something to the effect of "...on the basis that if I can do it, anyone can...". I also recall saying that I'd write something for Mike M for the Tome about generating drawings from pictures of stock taken at an angle, so this will get me onto my backside and typing.

Do you have a type of loco in mind? The suggestion of browsing the Loco Shed section is a good one if you're looking for inspiration, but if you've got a cunning plan already, then let's have a butchers.

But to get you started, here's a rough and ready attack on one of the 'Union' battery-electrics...

Image

It's about as simple as you can get, but I can demonstrate a couple of tricks to get you started. There are other ways of doing this, but here's how I learned it all those years ago. Now ideally, you'd have front and side elevations, but that's not always possible, as anyone who's tried to photograph stuff in museums and so on will attest. And here, of course, we have only one picture.

I add a border and mark in some construction lines, following the perspective - all parallel lines will meet at the same point, and in this case there are plenty of parallel lines, so just to illustrate here are a few....

Image

Now of course, it would help if we had some dimensions, but the catalogue doesn't give them, so, in true Gn15 style, I'll make an educated guess. I'll assume that the track gauge is 2 foot - I take verticals up and add some more verticals in that I'll need for the drawing later....

Image

extend the verticals, and now I use another perspective trick. I mark in a line half-way between my two horizontals (as I say, this is rough and ready - I'd normally do this accurately rather than by eye). If you mark in a diagonal across the vertical at the half-way line, then drop a vertical at each point where the diagonal intersects the horizontals and repeat the process, the spacing between the verticals on the picture diminishes as the perspective lines get closer together, but represent the same actual distance. ...

okay, I could prove that mathematically, but just accept for the moment that it's true. If the track gauge is in fact two foot, then the loco is about four foot wide - 48mm in my version of G scale, and about the right proportion for a maximum width Gn15 loco - what a coincidence! If, however, the gauge is 18", in line with another loco shown in the brochure, then the loco is about 36mm wide - a decent width for a mine loco, in fact. You can take your choice.

Image

Note that the corners are rounded, I've dropped the verticals where the edges would be if they weren't rounded off. The body-work is close to two feet high if the gauge is 2', 18" if the gauge is 18".

Now for the sides. Again, I've just done this by eye for the moment.

Image

I've only gone halfway along, you can do the rest if you want. but we have another dimension to guess at here. The cab area comes out at about 3'6" long including all the gubbins, if this is a two-footer - if it's an 18", then we end up with 2'9" or thereabouts, which seems a bit narrow to my eye. So I'll go with two foot for now, in which case the loco is about 11'6 long and I make the wheelbase about 3'6" (I haven't shown that bit, but I will if you want), which is close enough to a Bec 34mm chassis as to make no difference, but it's a big overhang, so at this stage I'd make a box and fiddle with it until it looked right.

Hopefully, you get the basic idea...

regards
Andy A
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gnine: less is the gnew more

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Postby johna » Wed Oct 31, 2012 6:26 pm

Thanks for the info Andy,once I get home from work tonight I will get the ruler out and try and draw a loco based on your idea.
I have also ordered a seated driver.


John

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Postby Gerry Bullock » Sat Dec 08, 2012 8:47 pm

johna wrote:For 16.5 gauge I have a number of "bec" motor bogies. I would be grateful if you show me how to do it myself.

John


Hi John,
If you have Bec bogies can I ask if they are 34mm w/b with 10.5 mm wheels.
If the answer is YES, you could do worse than asking Steve Bennett for a BEC underframe which he produces. Not too expensive and makes the BEC mounting less of a hassle.
Just a satisfied customer. :wink:
So little time, so many ideas!!!!! GerryB.
http://gn15gnutt.blogspot.com/

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Postby michael » Mon Dec 24, 2012 12:20 am

Andy, I really liked the way you bodged up the drawings of the battery Loco Bertrand mentioned that he look for chaps like you to work in the design office. :wink:

Dictionary definition at Macton for the word "Bodged"
1) the skilful use of ancient drawing instruments like pencils.
2) ability to see the hidden lines and translate them
3) general all round ability to work outside the box.
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