Bagnall Sipat in O9

Minimum gauge modelling in other scales.

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Brack
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Bagnall Sipat in O9

Postby Brack » Sun Jun 24, 2012 2:17 pm

I posted the rough shot of the 3d print on the Baby Bagnalls thread, but thought I ought to make my own thread to show progress.

Bear in mind that this is prototype 1, and that there have been a couple of modifications to the CAD file since (I'm about to order prototype 2, if that one's OK then I'll be making these available through shapeways). Also I haven't used any filler on the bodywork at all, as I wanted to dispel the idea some people have that 3D printing can't produce an acceptable surface for a model. All that I've done was sand it down with some 1600 grit paper, a couple of coats of Klear, then archer rivets (and resin w glue/cocktail stick method for the curved rivets on the front of the tank), a spray of halfords grey primer, and brush painted using acrylics.

The chassis is a fleischmann 7000 (cheap secondhand, easily available, and a good reliable runner), which takes about 3 minutes to alter (cut back the plastic using big scissors to take off the cylinders and trim back the sides so they just cover the pickups and clip on, clip off suppressors and resolder the left over bits of suppressor wires from pickup to motor mount).

This one is open cabbed, as the safety valve bonnet didn't print, so I had to scratchbuild new safety valves from styrene rod, old guitar string and a bit of old brass etch. Hopefully the valve bonnet will print on the second prototype (I've changed it a little and it seems to pass shapeways' tests).

forgive the barrel distortion - its a small camera used at close quarters! The actual model is about 28mm wide and 64mm long, so these photos are pretty unkind close ups shown several times life size.

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Some have suggested that I put the rivets on the print, but using the archer rivets means that you can smooth the print without worrying about losing the rivet detail.

I am also looking into producing the Sipat class in 1:17 (to fit onto an ETS chassis) and Gn15 (to fit onto a bachmann percy/greg chassis)

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Postby Glen A » Sun Jun 24, 2012 7:01 pm

Gnice model.
Good job. 8)

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Leo

Postby bandmbill » Sun Oct 28, 2012 7:19 pm

Do you have any pictures of a finished Leo70 in 09?
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Postby Brack » Tue Oct 30, 2012 5:42 pm

I haven't actually finished it yet! give me a few days and I'll sort it out for you.

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Postby Brack » Wed Oct 31, 2012 6:19 pm

Bill - here are a few shots of my first test print, in primer, propped on the chassis. I've put one of the black dog steel tipplers in for scale. I'm afraid I only had time to spray a little primer on it, I haven't finished cleaning up the print on this one (the print quality on this and the other item I bought at the same time was the worst I've ever had from shapeways - I should've complained - they normally reprint them for you if you're not happy, but I was excited about the new model and started working on it before I realised I should've just asked them to do it again). There are a few lines still visible on it, they will be got rid of over the next little while. I've changed the model slightly since then, just to strengthen the join to the front bufferbeam and to give a little more clearance for the worm gear beneath the boiler, though visibly it'll look exactly the same. Sadly I haven't got the new files uploaded yet (same with the Gn15 Bagnall) as I've been a bit busy of late. Currently shapeways' servers are down anyway as they're based in new york and have no power (their website says it should be back on in 4 or 5 days).

Anyway, hope these few poor photos are OK for now, bear in mind that I haven't cleaned up the print properly yet. Although the prototype is for 2ft gauge, I think it works very well in O9

Image

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Postby bandmbill » Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:04 pm

Looks brilliant - I have to get one - how much space is there for weight - I do need to get a DCC decoder in as well.

How do I order one - also how much?
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Postby bandmbill » Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:33 pm

Just been browsing YouTube and other sites - how does the coal bunker work?
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Postby Brack » Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:54 pm

As far as I can tell the bunker is purely cosmetic (or a handy outside shelf). I did toy with making it functional, but thought I'd follow prototype. It's drawn from drawings of a similar loco supplied by febalok (who I think made it!) Slightly modified to match photos.

As soon as shapeways are back up I'll upload the new file (slight improvements) and let you know.

As far as fitting a chip/weight, it needs lead at the front to balance the motor. The boiler, dome and tanks are hollow, and you could perhaps fit a decoder in the cab, either alongside the firebox (the rear of the tanks are left open) or in the fake bunker or under the roof. There is a (brake?) Lever in front of the fake bunker as per prototype but that'd be easily removed if need be.

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Postby rue_d_etropal » Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:23 am

got email today, to say Shapeways are back up and running.
Simon Dawson
(Simon D.),
Narrow gauge Francophile interested in 1m, 60cm,50cm , 40cm and smaller gauges . Build in scales from 1/6th to 1/24th. Also 1/32nd and 1/35th using 16.5mm track to represent 50cm and 60cm gauges.
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Gn15

Postby chris69 » Sat Nov 03, 2012 8:02 pm

Hi,
you plan on bringing this great steam critter out in Gn15?
if so would love one....
Greetings
Chris :lol: :lol: 8)
It's my RR and it exists,in my mind!!!!!!!!

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Leo70/Bagnall Sipat

Postby Brack » Sat Nov 03, 2012 9:35 pm

I didn't have any plans for Leo70 in Gn15 as such.... The difficulty with Gn15 is that the volume of material involved increases dramatically with the bigger scales, so the price gets high. I'm still working on getting the Bagnall in 1/24 (I've prepared a 4th version of the CAD and asked shapeways to test it - the previous 3 iterations uploaded fine, passed all their checks fine, then when I ordered them they said it wouldn't print). The big issue is that things are priced in euros, and a Gn15 version of Sipat comes in at almost £70 (current exchange rates/shapeways pricing changes make it move around a bit), with Leo70 taking a similar volume of material so I expect a similar price. I'm not sure how many I'd sell at that rate and whether or not it'd be worth the time and effort it takes. I personally model in O9, so I don't mind the effort of producing it for myself, but I think I'd lose a fair bit of money and time to redraw and test print for a scale I don't personally model in and which would probably be priced too highly for the market.

Sorry, that isn't a definite 'no', I could be persuaded, but I suspect that most modellers in Gn15 either can't afford that price (and I can sympathise with that) or prefer to scratchbuild. Perhaps a better option would be to release a loco fittings pack for Leo70 in 1/24 (smokebox door, whistle, bell, chimney, dome, gauge glasses and pressure gauge) which would be more reasonably priced and perhaps send you the drawings? If you had those fittings the loco itself is shaped quite nicely for scratchbuilding out of sheet styrene with a suitable tube for the boiler.

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Postby rue_d_etropal » Sun Nov 04, 2012 12:16 am

I agree, some form of conversion kit would be better in bigger scales, as cost of complete body would be too high for many people here.
Looking at possible donors, I would suggest the Hornby Bill/Ben for saddle tanks and one of the Hornby side tank locos(one has quite a wide boiler, but is otherwise not very good)
Conversion kit to contain boiler fittings, but also a cab, as this should not be too pricey.
For me 3D printing is probably best for difficult curved shapes. I would love to produce something for a French railcar, like those on Vivarais. A complete body in bigger scales would be horrendously expensive, but curved ends, and maybe the roof, might be OK.
It is sometimes easy to go over the top and in effect over design, when all that is needed is the essential, which can be added to by simple scratch building or adaptation.
Simon Dawson
(Simon D.),
Narrow gauge Francophile interested in 1m, 60cm,50cm , 40cm and smaller gauges . Build in scales from 1/6th to 1/24th. Also 1/32nd and 1/35th using 16.5mm track to represent 50cm and 60cm gauges.
http://www.rue-d-etropal.com

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Postby Moronguhl » Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:19 am

This is looking beautiful Brack - when is the second boxier loco going up on Shapeways for sale? Looks like a lovely model.
Christian Summers

We're gonna need a little rolling stock...and a lot of luck!

I used to have a project link here until the thread was deleted... :(

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Postby Brack » Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:27 pm

the test print shoudl be with me in a week or two, if that works, I'll make it available!

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Postby Brack » Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:46 pm

OK, The second test print of Leo70 arrived today and is perfect, so that oen is now available on my shapeways shop. The 1/24 (Gn15) Bagnall Sipat also arrived and has printed OK (eventually). I also got another O9 Sipat after agreeing to sell one of mine, I found another chassis cheap so I had to....

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Postby Simon Andrews » Fri Nov 23, 2012 1:50 pm

Just seen your posting over on Trade Tittle tattle, the prints look great 8)

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Postby Brack » Fri Nov 23, 2012 4:22 pm

Thanks Simon. I'm pretty happy with them, I've actually agreed to let the open cab O9 Sipat go, thinking I only need the one (you know how you're always somehow more attached to your last built loco) but then I saw a suitable chassis come up for sale cheaply and I had a few things to order anyway....

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Ozymandias

Postby bandmbill » Sun Dec 02, 2012 10:13 pm

Did the reply a few posts back mean that you are going to produce Ozymandias?
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Postby Brack » Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:07 pm

No plans for Ozymandias, but a full article detailing its building has been submitted for inclusion in a forthcoming 7mmNGA publication. I'm afraid I'm not planning on doing a 3D printed version - the outisde frame conversion and reversing the cylinder positions requires a bit of chassis work. The fittings on it are pilfered from various kits, though if I were to do it again I'd use the fittings pack from Sipat. The boiler is a syringe barrel, the rest plasticard (including the cranks and outside frames) whilst the cab roof is from a dapol pug!. There is also a healthy amount of lead shot in the boiler barrel, wing tanks, firebox and some lead sheet between the frames at the back. The axles are simply 1.5mm brass rod with the fleischmann wheels on them.

given time, and a fair wind (and no distractions) on the 'wish list' are (in no particular order) Hudswell Culverin class (royal arsenal), Hunslet Jack or Waril Class, Small Couillet 040t to fit fleischmann 7000 (as used at minas de barruelo in spain), and reduced version of a decauville type 1.

The big issue is finding suitable chassis for the Culverin and waril class, plus the hunslet needs walschaerts valve gear, I'm tempted to try and do a chassis in 3D printing, or convert an existing bachmann 060 chassis to outside frames and 4 wheels. I suspect that someone like Brian Madge could be useful to build a suitable chassis, but I haven't spoken to him yet about it.

If you're aware of a 9mm gauge chassis with approx 10-14mm wheels and a 21 (jack), 22.7 (all of the royal arsenal locos) or 24.5mm (waril class) wheelbase (and walschaerts) I'd be very interested! the 18" locos are a bit bigger though, you can see why John Knowles thought their Sipat class (Scout) underpowered when you compare the size of it to Jack or Gwen.

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Ozzy

Postby bandmbill » Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:08 pm

Is there a set of drawings for Ozymandias?
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Postby Brack » Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:22 pm

Leo70 is all finished now:

Image

next project is a small Couillet 040t, though I have another sipat to finish in the mean time, and a layout to get on with!

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Postby Moronguhl » Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:25 am

Looks beautiful Brack, excellent work!
Christian Summers



We're gonna need a little rolling stock...and a lot of luck!



I used to have a project link here until the thread was deleted... :(

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Re: Bagnall Sipat in O9

Postby ChrisMears » Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:39 am

Brack wrote:Image

I really like the look of this engine. I think I found a listing for it on the Shapeways website this evening. The proportions are really attractive. It's probably just me, but I've never had much luck finding one of these Fleischmann Black Anna chassis for sale but it does look great here. Could a Tomix Percy chassis be used?

Cheers

/chris
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Re: Bagnall Sipat in O9

Postby Gerry Bullock » Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:36 am

ChrisMears wrote: It's probably just me, but I've never had much luck finding one of these Fleischmann Black Anna chassis for sale but it does look great here. Could a Tomix Percy chassis be used?

Cheers

/chris


Hi Chris, welcome back. If you visit the German eBay site you'll have no problem in finding a Black Anna - great little chassis.
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eBay you say

Postby ChrisMears » Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:06 pm

Thanks Gerry. I just took a look on eBay and I see one in there now. The price was low enough so I've put in a bid. I'll take a look at German eBay later today too.
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