Limit, Pick & Shoehorn RR -- Dallas M's layout project

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Limit, Pick & Shoehorn RR -- Dallas M's layout project

Postby Dallas_M » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:51 pm

Hello Gnatterboxers --

Looks like I'll join those of you operating Gn15 layouts some time this century! :wink:

Here's a sketch of the proposed scene:

Image

And here's a photo of trackwork currently underway:
Image

Size is roughly 3x6' ... a little less than 1x2m. Goal for this winter is to finish the "Uncle Buck" rail truck and construct mock-up buildings for the layout to determine final placement of the different sidings. No chance of an "overnight sensation" here :roll: ... but after I hook up a few more wires, I'll have a nice place for the trains to go roundy-round while I work on various Gn15 projects! :D

Thanks to all for the continuous supply of ideas and inspiration!
Cheers,
Dallas

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Postby Glen A » Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:05 pm

Wow, Dallas
That's a good looking sketch. :shock:
If it ends up even half as good as what you have drawn (and knowing your high standard of modelling it will) it will be a really great layout.

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Postby scott b » Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:23 pm

Can`t wait to see the progress on this Dallas. What are those to guys doing there in front of the coal cars, the guy with the hat looks like he`s giving the other guy heck, I don`t know why, he`s h armless... :wink: could not resist.
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Postby Rowley » Tue Jan 06, 2009 10:49 pm

Hi Dallas
Looks an interesting concept Great sketch the road seems to be climbing upwards towards the right, with the building on the right being elevated Is that the idea
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Postby joe gilmartin » Tue Jan 06, 2009 10:57 pm

Dallas.....
Great drawing reminds me a little of the coal mine area of the East Broad Top
South Ohio ,Tennessee northern Kentucky can't wait till
you get a little more done
Is there a still up the "Holler"?

cheers
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Postby Dallas_M » Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:25 am

Hi Guys -- Thanks for the notes!

Yes, intended to represent eastern-US coal mining ... most likely West Virginia ... which has much the same flavor as Kentucky, and similar to the EBT ... even pondering a truck-dump coal loader (like EBT) ... but probably go with a tipple.

The tall structure on the right will be a tipple. All of the track is level, but the scenery rises up toward the back left corner. Center area will be elevated as well, with the road going down to a crossing ... well, at least I think so!

Once I'm done flipping it over to do the wiring and turnout controls, I hope to start making some mock-ups of the structures and see how well things will fit. Already made a change from the sketch to add a storage siding on the front right corner ...

And, of course, I'll try to find a place to hide a still in the trees! :lol:
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby Dallas_M » Sat Jan 10, 2009 6:07 am

Hmm ... not sure I'll be able to resist the urge to build a critter to haul the work train as this progresses ....

Image

Cardstock cab to check size ... actual cab now under "destruction" ... seems the "builder" is beating it up a bit even before it goes into service! :shock:

"Hood" (or bonnet) is left-over body shell from an HO log loader ... think I like the shape ... will have to see what I can work out there ... :roll:
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby Dallas_M » Thu Jan 15, 2009 8:52 am

A little more progress on a "big" little critter to haul the work train around and help with layout construction ...

Image

Styrene (plasticard) cab is well underway ... just needs another 80 or so rivets ... but who's counting? :lol:

Yesterday I took a look at the HO Alco S-1 mechanism to see if I could replace the drive wheels with some larger wheels that I had handy ... but, alas, the axles on the HO drive are much smaller than those on the potential replacement wheels ...

So, rather than get into fabricating axle bushings, replacing gears or other mechanoid wonders ... the "Easy Plan B" has been implemented ... full tram skirting ... as shown in the cardstock mock-up ...

Further progress as time allows ... plenty of time left to pester Gerry into posting more of his great structure photos before those are needed on this layout! :lol: 8)
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby Prof Klyzlr » Fri Jan 16, 2009 6:11 am

Dear Dallas,

What a horrible thing to do to a AHM HO Barnhart... :wink:

Bearing in mind the sub 12" dia wheels on some mining equipment, I would have thought the S1's wheels/trucks would have fit in nicely in Gn15, maybe with some oversized brake cylinders and axlebox covers added :?:
(I know adding tramway skirting is the easy option,
but there's something about not being able to see the wheels/trucks move as the loco glides/rocks around the layout... )

Looking good Dallas... :wink: :D
Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
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Re: Limit, Pick & Shoehorn RR -- Dallas M's layout proje

Postby altterrain » Fri Jan 16, 2009 6:24 am

Dallas_M wrote: Goal for this winter is to finish the "Uncle Buck" rail truck


Uncle Buck! I loved that guy! :)

Image


-Brian
Image

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Postby Dallas_M » Fri Jan 16, 2009 6:46 pm

Prof Klyzlr wrote:Bearing in mind the sub 12" dia wheels on some mining equipment, I would have thought the S1's wheels/trucks would have fit in nicely in Gn15, maybe with some oversized brake cylinders and axlebox covers added :?:
(I know adding tramway skirting is the easy option,
but there's something about not being able to see the wheels/trucks move as the loco glides/rocks around the layout... )


Thanks for the feedback ... and additional feedback is welcome ... as I'm still not 100% decided on this ...

Image

Here's a comparison ... at top, the mock-up cab and body parts atop the S-1 mechanism ... trucks/wheels do look a bit small ... but there is a certain "charm" to the design.

Below: Deck elevated a bit, styrene cab placed and mock-up tram skirt added ...

I got on the phone yesterday and ordered more rivets from the friendly folks at Grandt Line ... have enough to keep me busy finishing the cab and plenty of work to do on the hood and rear section.

So, again feedback welcome ... especially regarding whether to finish it with or without the side skirts in the chassis area ...

PS -- Brian, yes "Uncle Buck" will make an appearance on the layout ... also the "Celebrity Farm Blow-up" characters of Big Jim McBride and Billy Saw Hurock may make cameo appearances! :lol: [SCTV characters]
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby Nick Ellingworth » Fri Jan 16, 2009 7:04 pm

Personally I'd go for the tram skirts option, I think it makes the loco look a little bulkier.
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Postby scott b » Fri Jan 16, 2009 8:57 pm

I like the one with the skirts, but I`m like that. I think one or 2 of the access panels open or broken may be a nice addition.
I do think either one would blow up real good Ya real good! :wink:
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Postby Glen A » Fri Jan 16, 2009 8:58 pm

Nick is right about the skirt making it look bulkier.
So it depends what effect you want to achieve.

I would have gone without skirt, but this means the HO axle boxes need to be bulked up to look right. I would then add thick headstocks across each end, a step on each side (next to the headstock) to get on to the running board. A chunky step below the cab. And maybe even a round air tank under the cab??

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Postby Prof Klyzlr » Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:54 pm

Dear Dallas,

Seeing the "side by side" confirms it for me,

- Bulk up the fuel tank

Whether with a "larger tank"styrene wrapper that can hide pourable lead, or with some additional airtanks and/or access steps suchlike a la Jeff Saxton's Sekiu #8

Image

- Big chunky endbeams/headstocks

or maybe thicker but "narrower" ones,again Jeff S's #8 surprised me with its appeal in ths area... (I always thought #8 was wider than it appears)

Image

- and some basic "bulked up" truck details.

Cut the axleboxes of a pair of spare Bachmann On30 archbar trucks,
the ones under the On30 boxcars that everyone is replacing with the newer "lo profile" archbars :wink:
and they should glue straight over the top of the diesel truck axleboxes.

Some styrene tube for the brake cylinders, brass wire for the piston, and some styeren strip for the "actuating bar", and you have a brake cylinder mech that xan be easily "hung" at the top corner of each sideframe...

( Image

NB the larger sandboxes easily visible on either side of the front steps. Those are mounted on the trucks!

For reference
http://www.zelmeroz.com/album_rail/qld/jf-hr/moreton/D%20Coolum.pdf )

Even with excessive riveted construction, a metal skirt on such a loco somehow doesn't feel "US mining" to me. (Maybe "armoured simplex", but that's a whole different other prototype and story...).

Just my 0.05c +GST... :wink:
Happy Modelling,

Aim to Improve,

Prof Klyzlr

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Postby mad gerald » Sat Jan 17, 2009 8:12 pm

Dallas,

I like the bulky look of your loco and I vote for the skirts - but perhaps a little less detailed?!

What size does your loco actually reach?

I suggest a big fuel tank too, perhaps a toolbox on the rear part and a more visible engine (i. e. caterpillar) - or one out of a truck kit ...

And what kind of rivets do you use? Are they like these ...

http://de.vario-helicopter.biz/shop/pro ... s_id=31668
Last edited by mad gerald on Sat Jan 17, 2009 8:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Dallas_M » Sat Jan 17, 2009 8:14 pm

THANKS ALL for the feedback ... much APPRECIATED!

Also requested input from my On30 buddies, and it "seemed" like the side skirts would be the best compromise ... took another "look" :shock: at things following Prof's comments ... but still seemed like skirts would be the way to go ...

So, cut out the basic shape of those in styrene last night ... with the access panels over the trucks removed to be set in separately ... and this suggested another possible "in between" solution :idea: ... the skirts WITHOUT the truck covers suggest a sufficiently bulked up frame .... have to make some slight modifications to get a good view and play with that idea some more.

One thing for certain ... full-skirting on a two-truck (twin-bogie) chassis makes it DANG NEAR IMPOSSIBLE to re-rail the thing! :? :cry: :wink: :lol:

Did make a little bit of "actual" progress last night ... set in the pads for coupler mounting at the desired height and raised the deck to the desired level ... more when able! Thanks again for the ideas.
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby Dallas_M » Sat Jan 17, 2009 8:25 pm

Hi Gerald --

It's a mad, mad world :lol: and I appreciate your thoughts!

Yes, those rivets do look the same. I used Grandt Line #156 Rivets for most of the cab. They are .063" diameter ... and if my math is correct, that's very close to 1.5 mm.

Overall length of the frame is a little over 5-3/4" long ... about 14.8 cm.

Also, I experimented with a "fake" way to stamp louvers for the hood panels ... preliminary tests look good ... if it works, I'll post photos when I get that far!
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby mad gerald » Sat Jan 17, 2009 8:44 pm

Dallas_M wrote:Yes, those rivets do look the same. I used Grandt Line #156 Rivets for most of the cab. They are .063" diameter ... and if my math is correct, that's very close to 1.5 mm.


... so are mine ... :lol:

Dallas_M wrote:Overall length of the frame is a little over 5-3/4" long ... about 14.8 cm.


What size does it reach in heigth, I mean, are your engineers supposed to drive it upright (or sitting)?

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Postby Dallas_M » Sat Jan 17, 2009 8:52 pm

mad gerald wrote:What size does it reach in heigth, I mean, are your engineers supposed to drive it upright (or sitting)?


Hi Gerald --

Engineer will drive it in the seated position ... I'll post some photos late tonight.

Cab is approx. 7 cm or 2-3/4" high. (Measurement of cab only, not loco)
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby Dallas_M » Sun Jan 18, 2009 5:15 am

Here are some more photos for Mad Gerald ... and anyone else who finds them handy! :wink:

Image

This photo shows an SLM 1/24 scale figure standing next to the loco.

Image

Here's a Carlo Spirito 1/24 scale figure seated on a bench in front of the cab ... gives a good idea of how he fits inside. Poor fellow has a difficult time operating the loco without any arms ... he has to bang his head on the control panel to get it to move ... then bang his head again to make it stop ... by the end of the day, he has a terrible headache ... and he can't open the bottle of aspirin! :shock:

Cab measurements are shown on the photo.

Now, I have a couple of late night hours to fiddle with this ... a vast array of truck (bogie) parts, journals, air tanks and what-not scattered across my workbench ... will see if I can work out the bottom half of this project ... or I might just give up and drill and install more rivets like a happy idiot! :lol:

If all goes well, we'll see if we can clone some arms for that driver! :wink:

Thanks Carlo, I think this guy will find a good home very soon ... and I still know where to find the bag of arms!
Carlo's figures can be found here: http://www.spirito.biz/models.html
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby mad gerald » Sun Jan 18, 2009 12:43 pm

Hi Dallas,

thank you for the additional information and photos!

Perhaps Carlo Spirito doesn't mind some after work chill out in a local handbangers ballroom?!?! :P :P :P

My big and bully-minded foreman measures 8 cm - would make him a 6 footer in real life.

The height of my front/rear parts of my cab (cab/twin cab/box cab - I'm still not quite sure) is approx. 85mm and seemed really tall to me. The left one is the laser cut part from my acryl kit, the right one is handcrafted by me:

Image

I'm still in doubt with the window shapes :P

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Postby John New » Sun Jan 18, 2009 1:16 pm

I'm still in doubt with the window shapes


Nice model. My instinct is that the right hand one would be easier to do on a full size jobbie, and gives more visibility for the driver, so would be the one they would have built of the two as cab front strength not a critical issue. Therefore that becomes the one to model.
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Postby Gerry Bullock » Sun Jan 18, 2009 1:51 pm

mad gerald wrote:The height of my front/rear parts of my cab (cab/twin cab/box cab - I'm still not quite sure) is approx. 85mm and seemed really tall to me. The left one is the laser cut part from my acryl kit, the right one is handcrafted by me:


If driver is to be seated Gerald that's too tall - I have some half dozen cabbed Locos and all bar one (seated drivers) are 65mm in height. I should add that I work to 1/24 scale. My Vitacress Loco (built to scale - again 1/24) has a cab height of 55mm and can be seen here.
One Loco, built by Scott, has a cab height of 85mm BUT driver (1/24 scale) is standing.
So little time, so many ideas!!!!! GerryB.
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Postby greengiant » Sun Jan 18, 2009 2:22 pm

Hi Dallas

Just catching up with this thread.

Side skirts get my vote and maybe have one cab door open or missing, that way you get some more depth/texture to the model.

Nice to see you on this forum.

Martin
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