The GnATTERbox

Will Vale · Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:22 am Post subject: O9 Senussi loco

Hi all,

Having bought some track and collected baseboard materials for a possible O9 layout, I thought I ought to build some stock before proceeding Smile

Here are some pics of my progress after a couple of evenings' bodging:

You can see the (2 foot gauge) prototype here:

http://cas.awm.gov.au/photograph/020393
http://cas.awm.gov.au/photograph/020394

This is all I have to go on at the moment, but I think it's a heavily-bodged channel frame Simplex, or one where a new channel frame has been constructed (the buffer beams look totally different from all other Simplices I've seen). I scaled it out from the drawings and mechanism (with very wrong wheelbase) at 24x48mm in plan, which I later discovered isn't too far wrong for some real Simplex locos at around 8'x4'.

Construction is styrene sheet with Plastruct U-section superglued below the footplate. I'm quite happy with the bonnet, less so the toolbox which isn't quite square. I seem to have a hard time cutting perfectly square corners so I spend a bit of time afterwards with a file cleaning things up.

Also, are there any cheap kits which are good sources of 1:48 engine parts?

Will

PS: It's my first loco so be gentle with me!

Colin Peake · Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 3:16 pm Post subject:

Progressing well Will, I must admit that when I first saw it I thought what I now know is the bonnet was a very low cab! You seem to have been very brave cutting back that Kato chassis, or is that the version which is harder to get in the UK?

Can't say that I'm convinced that the original is a Simplex, but I'm sure someone will know for certain.

Colin
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Colin Peake
www.shiftingsands.fotopic.net (O9 Project)
www.miniaturerailways.fotopic.net (The real thing!)
www.colinpeake.fotopic.net (4mm Scale Models)

kevmor · Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 9:12 pm Post subject: Senussi Loco

Will, I think you will find that the loco is a Malcolm Moore 2' gauge V8 powered. The protuberance on the front is probably a concrete weight to assist traction up to the cave.

Will Vale · Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:47 pm Post subject:

Simon Andrews · Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:56 am Post subject:

Off too a great start Will. Its an interesting looking loco, I was wondering if it may in fact be a Baguley / Hibberd product Question

These two companies colaborated to produce a number of 'Ford - Planet' tractors that had transverse engines. A number of these went to the War Dept.

A 500mm gauge tractor was also built for Theakston for use in Turkey. Pictures of many of these locos are in the new IRS Baguley - Drewry book.

Simon.
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Simon Andrews · Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 9:31 am Post subject:

Just found this link http://www.irsociety.co.uk/Archives/14/Planet.htm There has also been an article in Industrial & Narrow Gauge Review.

Simon.
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Will Vale · Posted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 4:06 am Post subject:

Cheers Simon! Looking at all these pictures of channel-frame locos I think I might need to redo some of what I've made so far. At the moment the footplate is 1mm styrene with Plastruct framing beneath, but this effectively makes the top of the channel about twice as thick as the bottom. I was kind of thinking there'd be a footplate on the real things, but I guess the frame provides all the strength so it isn't required.

I think I might rip (carefully!) the bonnet off and remake the chassis so that the thick plastic sits inside the frame. Probably with a layer of thin styrene on top of the whole thing to give a clean surface to build the bodywork on. Should make it easier to fit the engine and radiator as well, since I kind of forgot about those in my eagerness to get the bonnet on!

Or perhaps I should get some brass channel for a real scale feel. Question

Hmm...

Will

Will Vale · Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 1:58 am Post subject:

The back issue of Light Railways arrived at the weekend, and unfortunately it doesn't add much in the way of hard facts. The unidentified loco remains unidentified, but the author does offer another possibility. Apparently it looks like a loco seen at the Umm Bogma Manganese mines in Egpyt, and it was suggested that it could be a Ruhrthaler of some kind.

I dug up a video on YouTube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czWwwKkXG2k

which certainly looks similar - bonnet, engine location, toolbox and channel frames are all about right, and the driving position matches too. Different buffer beams though.

On the model front I decided to be brave and remake the frame. I found some Evergreen channel which has much finer webs than the Plastruct section and was cheaper too. Photos to follow but it already looks much better, and I added some brass rod (couldn't get any square-section bar) inside the frames lengthwise to add weight and stiffness.

Cheers,

Will

KeithB · Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:28 am Post subject:

I like this video - no prize for guessing what's missing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NWU0B8sVUQ&NR=1
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Regards,
Keith

Everything comes to he who waits -
As long as he who waits, works like h*ll while he's waiting....

michael · Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:30 am Post subject:

We look forward to seeing the results Will.
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Regards Michael
If you believe you can make something, you can make it.

http://users.xplornet.com/~macton/index.html

Will Vale · Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 8:37 am Post subject:

Here's the new frame:

and in comparison with the old one:

I'm quite pleased with it to be honest - the brass gives it some heft, and it's a lot neater than the first version. I used some more of the channel to box in the rod below and again above, so all the bodywork and frame detail can be attached with solvent rather than superglue and the exposed surfaces are conveniently flat. The protrusion of the box below the frame isn't too obvious when it's on the rails either.

The buffer beams may not be final - I'm not quite sure about the shape (match prototype shape, or adjust angle for narrower gauge?) but I can always install a new layer using these as supports. Also not sure whether to put the axle boxes etc. in line with the chassis' wheels, or the prototype's. I'm leaning towards the latter and hoping the subterfuge won't be too visible.

Next job is to build some u-shaped structures at each end to support the bodywork and set the ride height of the frame on the chassis.

Cheers,

Will

Will Vale · Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:04 am Post subject:

A bit more progress:

to make

The bonnet and toolbox lid are left off since I still need to add weight and engine detail. The roof does fit but I knocked it before I took the picture - it should come to just past the edge of the angle iron frame on the side of the cab. Cheers to Paul for suggesting brass - much thinner and more robust than plastic.

I seem to have spent a lot of time recently attaching microstrip and then filing/sanding it down to give a thinner section. Viz the cab frame, which was cut from styrene channel (two L pieces for the price of one!) and then sanded once attached to thin the webs, and the toolbox catches which are made from three pieces of strip each much smaller than the jaws of my tweezers...

I also managed to bend one of the window pillars slightly - it should pull back into shape when the cab front is glued to the bonnet, but if there was some useful cab interior detail which could double as a reinforcement that would help. Any ideas?

I was feeling pretty happy until I looked at these pictures - it's not exactly handsome is it? Ah well, it looks better in real life - or at least that's my story Smile

Will

AndyA · Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:14 am Post subject:

It's a wonderful piece of work, Will. I like it a lot, can't wait to see it finished.

Regards
Andy A
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Gn15: Gnot so much a scale, more a state of mind
gnine: less is the gnew more
GnTonic - enjoy irresponsibly

Simon Andrews · Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:55 am Post subject:

Looks great Will Cool

I hope that my future attempts at scratch building are as good Very Happy

Simon.
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Will Vale · Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 3:49 am Post subject:

Thanks for the kind comments!

I realise that the closing remark of the previous message might have come off as a bit needy, so sorry about that Embarassed

I just think there's something not quite right in the pictures which is better in real life. Possibly it's that the chassis wheelbase is quite apparent from flash reflection. And quite wrong! I need to get around to fabricating some axle boxes and decide where to put them.

Latest development is that I bought a 'sprue' of Kadee NBWs because the sprue (a great solid chunk of metal) looks like the top of an engine block. The idea is to build a freelance diesel around a slice of this and get some weight and detail in one go. Still can't believe I bought a part for the sprue Exclamation

- even if it only cost $3. I'm sure I can stick the NBWs on something though.

Will

Willow Creek Traction · Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 4:27 am Post subject:

acousticco · Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 5:09 am Post subject:

That's a way too cool little engine. I have a very similar plate and channel (styrene) frame built on the same chassis that I built for an HOn30 diesel, but may become an O9 model...

-Cody
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http://miniaturerailways.blogspot.com/

Will Vale · Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 1:39 am Post subject:

Glen A · Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 5:35 am Post subject:

Thats a great engine Will.
I was about to ask where you got it, until I read you had scratch built it Shocked

Re the bonnet; Idea

Maybe you could cut some oval openings in the 45deg pannels, like they had a hinged opening for an insection cover, but the cover has fallen off (just put some rust hinges above the opening).

Also don't forget to put a radiator filer cap on the top of the bonnet Wink

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Glen Anthony.
Gnew Zealand

"The Stamping Ground"
http://www.trainweb.org/nzgr/Gn15/Gn15.html

Will Vale · Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:21 am Post subject:

I spent a fair while trying to avoid scratchbuilding while looking for a suitable casting, but nothing really came close. I nearly bought a Hot Wheels-style hot rod with exposed engine from the Warehouse, that was the best I could find.

The tip for the oval openings is a great one, but sadly not possible since there's lead shot concealed by Miliput in the upper part of the bonnet Sad

Next time I'll try and think everything through in advance...

Radiator cap, that I can manage Smile

Simon Andrews · Posted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 1:29 pm Post subject:

Great work Will, the engine looks very convincing Cool

Simon.
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acousticco · Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:51 pm Post subject:

That's truly a fantastic little engine Will!
I can't wait to see the next round of progress

-Cody
_________________
http://miniaturerailways.blogspot.com/

Korschtal · Posted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 10:07 am Post subject:

Very nice styrene work.
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Andy in Stuttgart
More railway misadventures on:
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Geeky Gecko · Posted: Sun Jan 18, 2009 9:33 am Post subject:

That's a great model, Will, and it's giving me inspiration for my next engine. The diesel engine is great - I've had ideas running through my feverish brain for some time on how to model a convincing motor. It's a great pity to cover it up with the bonnet. I realise you need all the weight you can get (don't we all?), but can't you put some in the toolbox and fuel tank to replace the weight in the bonnet? From a different perspective, I suppose it does tease the viewer into wanting to see more. Will follow your thread with interest.
Cheers,
_________________
Stefan

Will Vale · Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:15 pm Post subject:

Thanks for the kind comments, and apologies for not doing anything on this since January. I finally got down to it last night - I fitted axleboxes and some cab details. It's all a bit made up and sketchy but I think it's looking OK. There's a cab seat as well but that needs to be painted separately. I also have some fine braided wire (from a plotter carriage) and I was thinking of putting a coil of this on the brackets on the back.

The picture is quite cruel to my applied-by-eye bolts and overscale chequer plate Smile

Still to do:

Figure out the couplings.
Maybe add a few more NBWs - e.g. at the frame corners on the front + back.
Fit one more weight under the bonnet.
Clean all the crud off it and apply some primer.

Questions:

Given the military theme, what colour should the engine be? Would it be painted in the same colour as the bodywork?

Should there be an exhaust? If so, where?

Will